<snip>
> Initial cuts on either end of mortise location, then take half cuts
<snip>
I don't think I agree with this one. When I got my Delta mortiser a few
months ago, I broke the 1/4 inch bit because of deflection (as I found
out later). I think when using smaller bits it is better to make an
initial full cut, then successive cuts that are (say) 75-90% of full so
that the bit is fully engaged in the wood. If you take half cuts, the
bit deflects too much & may snap.
There is an article in Wood (I think - might be WW Journal) from a few
months back that goes over this point. Unfortunately, I didn't see it
until the bit broke.
I was using the standard Delta bits that came with the mortiser which,
admitedly are not premium by any means, but when I tried this with a
new bit, everything worked fine.
The smaller bits will snap easier, so more care is needed with them.
My 2ç.
Lou
In article <[email protected]>, Swingman
<[email protected]> wrote:
> "loutent" wrote in message news:081020040930538568%[email protected]...
>
> > > Initial cuts on either end of mortise location, then take half cuts
>
> > I don't think I agree with this one. When I got my Delta mortiser a few
> > months ago, I broke the 1/4 inch bit because of deflection (as I found
> > out later). I think when using smaller bits it is better to make an
> > initial full cut, then successive cuts that are (say) 75-90% of full so
> > that the bit is fully engaged in the wood. If you take half cuts, the
> > bit deflects too much & may snap.
>
> <snip>
> The smaller bits will snap easier, so more care is needed with them.
> >
> > My 2ç.
>
> In that case, I would be tempted to take that .02 and put it toward better
> bits and chisels.
No substitute for quality, that's for sure - and I intend to upgrade my
chisels/bits soon. Looking at the Fisch set.
Still, the technique described is probably a good one regardless of how
deep your pockets are - maybe even more so if you have a lot invested
in the bits.
Lou
> I don't find that the case at all with good chisels and bits and, as I
> mentioned in my OP, prudent care during use ... I've cut many thousands of
> mortises with my current sets of bits and chisels with never a suspicion of
> that problem, and I don't know anyone who has.
>
> The problem is more than likely the direct result of misuse ... best bet for
> good results with these benchtop machines is slow and easy.
>
> Don't hog the cuts, and smaller, repeated in and out cuts, will keep the
> cutting parts cooler in hard material ... you never want the chisel to get
> hot enough to lose temper and become brittle. You can generally tell when
> this has happened by the change in color on the leading edge of the tool.
Can't argue with your expertise - especially since I've only cut a few
dozen with my new mortising machine.
I did a quick check and the magazine with the article on mortising
technique was the June/July 'Wood". In particular, pg 102 has the
particular reference to (at least what they regard) as correct
overlapping options. Made some sense to me and it did work with my
cheapo bits.
In case anyone is interested.
Lou
In article <[email protected]>, Swingman
<[email protected]> wrote:
> "loutent" wrote in message
>
> > I did a quick check and the magazine with the article on mortising
> > technique was the June/July 'Wood". In particular, pg 102 has the
> > particular reference to (at least what they regard) as correct
> > overlapping options. Made some sense to me and it did work with my
> > cheapo bits.
>
> Multico has some good ones. Try these if you want to step up:
>
> http://www.garrettwade.com/jump.jsp?itemType=PRODUCT&iProductID=101759
Thanks for the link.
Took your "shop tour" - covet that TS & PM jointer (I have a Delta)
and except for the fact that its a separate building and a different
dimension, mine is similar - not as neat, but if I took pictures, I'd
have to pretty it up some I guess.
Oh yeah, mine is in the basement (rather be next to the vegetable
garden).
I like that quote too...
Lou
"patrick conroy" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>
> "Al Reid" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:RSj9d.3576$Va.2258@trndny08...
> >
>
> >
> > Much appreciated. I think I saw a similar recommendation in a thread a
> > couple of weeks back. Now that we have the chisels sharp, any other words
> > of wisdom?
>
> Look up the "forty cent method", email me if you can't find it.
> Did you get the 651 or the MM300?
> If the later, be careful w/ the 1/2" bits. That's how I sheared off some
> soft-steel part in mine.
>
>
I got the 651.
Thanks for the tip on the forty cent method. I assume you are referring to the method described at
http://home.comcast.net/~charliebcz/MChiselBitSettingTrick.html.
--
Al Reid
How will I know when I get there...
If I don't know where I'm going?
"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Al Reid" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:C5j9d.3736$Ua.3397@trndny01...
> > ...so now it's time to start the WWing for the fall/winter season. I
> > will
> > probably start by making a couple of child size chairs for my two grand
> > nieces.
> >
> > Any suggestions on proper/best use of the new toys(I mean tools) or
things
> > to look out for?
>
>
> Yeah. Immediately, before you cut your first mortise...Before you even
put
> the bit and chisel in the mortiser, sharpen the chisel and knock off the
> burrs inside the chisel at the cutting edge. Polishing the outside edge
of
> ht chisel is better still. It will make a BIG difference in the effort
you
> must exert to pull that handle down.
>
>
Leon,
Thanks. I guess I got a little ahead of myself. I did pit in the 1/4:
chisel and cut a few mortises in some maple. It cut with little effort and
no burning. I guess it probably isn't as noticeable with the small one as
it would be with the 1/2 chisel.
Al
Al Reid wrote:
> Much appreciated. I think I saw a similar recommendation in a thread a
> couple of weeks back. Now that we have the chisels sharp, any other words
> of wisdom?
>
> Al
Hi Al,
Check out the following article. The section on setting up the chisel/bit
spacing is useful.
http://www.newwoodworker.com/setupmort.html
--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
(Remove "SPAM" from email address to reply)
"loutent" wrote in message news:081020040930538568%[email protected]...
> > Initial cuts on either end of mortise location, then take half cuts
> I don't think I agree with this one. When I got my Delta mortiser a few
> months ago, I broke the 1/4 inch bit because of deflection (as I found
> out later). I think when using smaller bits it is better to make an
> initial full cut, then successive cuts that are (say) 75-90% of full so
> that the bit is fully engaged in the wood. If you take half cuts, the
> bit deflects too much & may snap.
<snip>
The smaller bits will snap easier, so more care is needed with them.
>
> My 2ç.
In that case, I would be tempted to take that .02 and put it toward better
bits and chisels.
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/04/04
"Al Reid" wrote in message
> Much appreciated. I think I saw a similar recommendation in a thread a
> couple of weeks back. Now that we have the chisels sharp, any other words
> of wisdom?
Just a couple gleaned from hours of drilling square holes while lost in
thought, in glorious solitude:
Measure your maximum depth of cut and maximum height of board that can be
cut with your particular machine and stay under those paramaters in your
designs. While you can put a riser on most of these machines, you generally
lose use of the fence when you do so, and it is a PITA to install/rremove
one.
Always place thin piece of wood below chisel and drill during initial setup
... chisels and drills are very sharp and you don't want to try to catch one
with your fingers, or dull it on the cast iron, when it slips.
Slot in hollow chisel should face either left or right, not to back or
front.
Always reference same face of workpieces against fence.
Double check squareness of chisel with fence, and depth of cut, on a test
piece of the same width. Tighten both down _securely_.
Initial cuts on either end of mortise location, then take half cuts in
between with the slot side of the chisel facing the cavity.
The bigger the chisel used, the slower you take it, take small plunges and
pull out of the hole frequently to clear debris away. (this IS on-topic, so
get your mind back on wwing!)
Keep your air hose handy to blow away chips.
Sit down, turn on the radio, and enjoy yourself.
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/04/04
"loutent" wrote in message
> No substitute for quality, that's for sure - and I intend to upgrade my
> chisels/bits soon. Looking at the Fisch set.
There are some that are made in Austria that are very good if you can find
them. AAMOF, Delta even included them with some machines a few years back
instead of the chinese ones... it was sort of luck-of-the-draw when you
opened the box.
> Still, the technique described is probably a good one regardless of how
> deep your pockets are - maybe even more so if you have a lot invested
> in the bits.
I don't find that the case at all with good chisels and bits and, as I
mentioned in my OP, prudent care during use ... I've cut many thousands of
mortises with my current sets of bits and chisels with never a suspicion of
that problem, and I don't know anyone who has.
The problem is more than likely the direct result of misuse ... best bet for
good results with these benchtop machines is slow and easy.
Don't hog the cuts, and smaller, repeated in and out cuts, will keep the
cutting parts cooler in hard material ... you never want the chisel to get
hot enough to lose temper and become brittle. You can generally tell when
this has happened by the change in color on the leading edge of the tool.
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/04/04
"Al Reid" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:2Hj9d.3561$4b.1113@trndny09...
> Leon,
>
> Thanks. I guess I got a little ahead of myself. I did pit in the 1/4:
> chisel and cut a few mortises in some maple. It cut with little effort
> and
> no burning. I guess it probably isn't as noticeable with the small one as
> it would be with the 1/2 chisel.
Yeah the bigger the chisel, the more effort. Lee Valley sells a cone shaped
sharpening stone to put in you drill. It does a great job of taking out the
burrs on inside cutting edge of the chisel. USE WITH A LIGHT TOUCH !!! I
used the Tormek to gently and quickly polish and sharpen the outer sides of
the chisels. I struggled with mine for a few years before learning this
trick.
"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Al Reid" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:2Hj9d.3561$4b.1113@trndny09...
> > Leon,
> >
> > Thanks. I guess I got a little ahead of myself. I did pit in the 1/4:
> > chisel and cut a few mortises in some maple. It cut with little effort
> > and
> > no burning. I guess it probably isn't as noticeable with the small one
as
> > it would be with the 1/2 chisel.
>
>
> Yeah the bigger the chisel, the more effort. Lee Valley sells a cone
shaped
> sharpening stone to put in you drill. It does a great job of taking out
the
> burrs on inside cutting edge of the chisel. USE WITH A LIGHT TOUCH !!!
I
> used the Tormek to gently and quickly polish and sharpen the outer sides
of
> the chisels. I struggled with mine for a few years before learning this
> trick.
>
Much appreciated. I think I saw a similar recommendation in a thread a
couple of weeks back. Now that we have the chisels sharp, any other words
of wisdom?
Al
"loutent" wrote in message
> I did a quick check and the magazine with the article on mortising
> technique was the June/July 'Wood". In particular, pg 102 has the
> particular reference to (at least what they regard) as correct
> overlapping options. Made some sense to me and it did work with my
> cheapo bits.
Multico has some good ones. Try these if you want to step up:
http://www.garrettwade.com/jump.jsp?itemType=PRODUCT&iProductID=101759
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/04/04
"Al Reid" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:RSj9d.3576$Va.2258@trndny08...
>
>
> Much appreciated. I think I saw a similar recommendation in a thread a
> couple of weeks back. Now that we have the chisels sharp, any other words
> of wisdom?
Look up the "forty cent method", email me if you can't find it.
Did you get the 651 or the MM300?
If the later, be careful w/ the 1/2" bits. That's how I sheared off some
soft-steel part in mine.
"Al Reid" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I got the 651.
Good. Here's hoping they used better quality steel in yours! :) If the 1/2"
seems hard going - I'd not pull too hard. Or, go ahead and pull hard and see
if it breaks -- if there's a Delta Service Center nearby. We have one close
by and it was about a week to repair.
>
> Thanks for the tip on the forty cent method. I assume you are referring
> to the method described at
> http://home.comcast.net/~charliebcz/MChiselBitSettingTrick.html.
>
A'yup!
"Al Reid" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:C5j9d.3736$Ua.3397@trndny01...
> ...so now it's time to start the WWing for the fall/winter season. I
> will
> probably start by making a couple of child size chairs for my two grand
> nieces.
>
> Any suggestions on proper/best use of the new toys(I mean tools) or things
> to look out for?
Yeah. Immediately, before you cut your first mortise...Before you even put
the bit and chisel in the mortiser, sharpen the chisel and knock off the
burrs inside the chisel at the cutting edge. Polishing the outside edge of
ht chisel is better still. It will make a BIG difference in the effort you
must exert to pull that handle down.