LB

Larry Blanchard

09/12/2013 5:40 PM

O/T: Grace Hopper

Those of you not involved with computers will wonder what made Admiral
Hopper worthy of a Google day. I had the very great privilege of meeting
and talking to her several times. She's worth a Google month at least.

This was one heck of a person back when women were supposed to be
housewives. The Wikipedia page gives details:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grace_Hopper#UNIVAC

but aside from its mention of "Amazing Grace" it's full of facts and not
of feelings.

She was already in her 60s when I met her. My first impression was how
alive she was. Full of energy and extremely intelligent. Also one heck
of a nice person. She was more proud of her navy career than of her
computer accomplishments. IIRC, her father was also in the Navy.

The Google animation ends with a moth flying out of the computer. Grace
has the honor of discovering the very first computer "bug", a moth that
created a short. The fried carcass was taped into the log book for the
day :-).

I met her at computer society meetings and various conventions. Often I
was the only other person around that had worked on Univac (software, not
hardware) so it was easy to get a conversation going - when she wasn't
surrounded by younger admirers.

The article mentions her famous "nanoseconds" - I've still got one of
those somewhere. It didn't mention that she also hauled around a
microsecond - about 1000 feet of wire. She joked that the phone company
wouldn't give her enough wire for a millisecond.

When she finally retired for good, they held the ceremony on "Old
Ironsides".

I could probably keep this up for another page or two, but suffice it to
say I can't remember anyone who impressed me as much as Grace Hopper.
She was the epitome of "one of a kind".

--
This message was for rec.woodworking - if it appears in homeownershub
they ripped it off.


This topic has 34 replies

Mm

MJ

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 9:02 PM

I too met her. I was doing a trade show in Virginia Beach for a Navy comput=
er show in the 80's. I was at some booth (not my companies) and I was disc=
ussing the benefits of my company's software (a database company - largest =
one in the world at the moment) and she appeared out the blue discussing ha=
rdware databases.

I tried to counter act her arguments and I was tongue tied. She was exactly=
like she appeared. I should have asked for an autograph. I was sorry I mis=
sed the opportunity, but it remains fresh in my mind as if it were yesterda=
y.

What a great woman, sailor, scientist and computer pioneer.=20

MJ

jj

jo4hn

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

10/12/2013 7:05 AM

On 12/9/2013 9:40 AM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
> Those of you not involved with computers will wonder what made Admiral
> Hopper worthy of a Google day. I had the very great privilege of meeting
> and talking to her several times. She's worth a Google month at least.
>
Amen. A very special icon in the world of CS. She understood the
process of software from understanding the problem through picking (or
designing) software to cope with the problem and finally to selecting
the hardware to host the software. I spoke with her all too briefly
just once. I will never forget.
mahalo,
jo4hn

DW

Doug Winterburn

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 9:19 AM

On 12/11/2013 09:03 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
> dpb wrote:
>
>>
>> While taking nothing away from Admiral Hopper, being on the
>> scientific/engineering computing side rather than business, John
>> Backus and FORTRAN was far more influential in the arena of my
>> experience followed probably most closely by Seymour Cray ( and the
>> CDC-6600).
>
> Well - that's only because you were living in the isolated world of
> scientific computing, which we all knew was just an "interesting"
> diversion...
>
>> I never had an opportunity to see any DG machines except from
>> afar...by the time left the mainframe organizations, the VAX/VMS was
>> nearly ubiquitous and then my career path went the other extreme of
>> embedded micros for quite a long period before the PC then became
>> powerful-enough to be of real use for anything beyond word processing
>> w/ the AT-class...
>
> I understand that. I saw - early on, the advatages of the small computer.
> It did not matter to me if it was the PC or the Sun model of the
> client/server infrastructure - it all came down to the same thing. Having
> come from the mainframe world, and even then with a continued appreciation
> for where the mainframe would fit in, that the small footprint compute
> device with some level of local compute capability as opposed to a simple
> dumb screeen - was the wave of the future. Ahhhhl.... the good old days.
>
>
This should bring back a few memories...

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/films/silicon/


--
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure,the creed of ignorance, and the
gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"
-Winston Churchill

LH

"Lew Hodgett"

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 2:32 PM


"Larry Blanchard" wrote:

> And then there was SCADA - supervisory control and data acquisition.
> Often just called process control. I got into that by accident and
> got
> involved in all sorts of strange but interesting projects.
------------------------------------------------------
The true SCADA required dedicated phone lines which made it very
expensive.

As a result most SCADA systems were found on things like waste water,
potable water, etc systems usually in major metro markets.

We represented a Canadian company that had developed a dial-up
mini SCADA that would monitor just a few points. (From memory about 8)

First developed to monitor small isolated installations in the
Canadian
boonies, we had success selling units to monitor waste water lift
stations all over the place.

A response to an off normal situation within a couple of minutes was
adequate and a major improvement.

The result was a very cost effective solution.

Lew

ME

Martin Eastburn

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

18/12/2013 10:38 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Admiral_Hopper

She brought computers - digital to the masses in the arm forces.

Large ships used analog computers in WW II. Digital since.
Check her out - she was something else! Cool lady.

Martin

On 12/17/2013 3:36 PM, Douglas Johnson wrote:
> Noons <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> On 10/12/2013 1:43 PM, j wrote:
>>
>>>> Those of you not involved with computers will wonder what made Admiral
>>>> Hopper worthy of a Google day. I had the very great privilege of meeting
>>>> and talking to her several times. She's worth a Google month at least.
>>
>> Aye, indeed!
>
> "Neener" seems to have dropped out usage around here, but I've got a first class
> neener. My company flew me to DC for the sole purpose of having lunch with her.
> I certainly agree with all the great comments about her. -- Doug
>

Sk

Swingman

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

10/12/2013 10:20 AM

On 12/9/2013 11:40 AM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
> Those of you not involved with computers will wonder what made Admiral
> Hopper worthy of a Google day. I had the very great privilege of meeting
> and talking to her several times. She's worth a Google month at least.
>
> This was one heck of a person back when women were supposed to be
> housewives. The Wikipedia page gives details:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grace_Hopper#UNIVAC
>
> but aside from its mention of "Amazing Grace" it's full of facts and not
> of feelings.
>
> She was already in her 60s when I met her. My first impression was how
> alive she was. Full of energy and extremely intelligent. Also one heck
> of a nice person. She was more proud of her navy career than of her
> computer accomplishments. IIRC, her father was also in the Navy.
>
> The Google animation ends with a moth flying out of the computer. Grace
> has the honor of discovering the very first computer "bug", a moth that
> created a short. The fried carcass was taped into the log book for the
> day :-).
>
> I met her at computer society meetings and various conventions. Often I
> was the only other person around that had worked on Univac (software, not
> hardware) so it was easy to get a conversation going - when she wasn't
> surrounded by younger admirers.
>
> The article mentions her famous "nanoseconds" - I've still got one of
> those somewhere. It didn't mention that she also hauled around a
> microsecond - about 1000 feet of wire. She joked that the phone company
> wouldn't give her enough wire for a millisecond.
>
> When she finally retired for good, they held the ceremony on "Old
> Ironsides".
>
> I could probably keep this up for another page or two, but suffice it to
> say I can't remember anyone who impressed me as much as Grace Hopper.
> She was the epitome of "one of a kind".

Very cool. Thanks for posting.

On a similar note, I'm almost finished rereading, on my iPad Kindle
Reader "Where Wizards Stay Up Late". Wasn't all that impressed the first
time, but glad I took the time to read it again ... something deeply
cool in reading, once again, about that historical time on a modern device.

My very favorite book on computers and the early culture was Tracy
Kidder's "Soul of A New Machine". Far from being on the bleeding edge
now, I'll never forget the sense of excitement of those times, having
been a miniscule part of it as an early embracer of computer technology
... including FidoNet, modem to modem application development, and early
corporate Ethernet LAN's.

And it more than pisses me off to see the "open" concept it once was,
now subverted by the likes of Google, Microsoft, FaceBook, et al, in the
pursuit of farkin' _advertising_ revenue.

Once again, thanks for posting.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
google.com/+KarlCaillouet
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

DJ

Douglas Johnson

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

17/12/2013 3:36 PM

Noons <[email protected]> wrote:

>On 10/12/2013 1:43 PM, j wrote:
>
>>> Those of you not involved with computers will wonder what made Admiral
>>> Hopper worthy of a Google day. I had the very great privilege of meeting
>>> and talking to her several times. She's worth a Google month at least.
>
>Aye, indeed!

"Neener" seems to have dropped out usage around here, but I've got a first class
neener. My company flew me to DC for the sole purpose of having lunch with her.
I certainly agree with all the great comments about her. -- Doug

jm

j

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

09/12/2013 9:43 PM

On 12/9/2013 12:40 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:

Thanks for posting this.

> Those of you not involved with computers will wonder what made Admiral
> Hopper worthy of a Google day. I had the very great privilege of meeting
> and talking to her several times. She's worth a Google month at least.
>
> This was one heck of a person back when women were supposed to be
> housewives. The Wikipedia page gives details:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grace_Hopper#UNIVAC
>
> but aside from its mention of "Amazing Grace" it's full of facts and not
> of feelings.
>
> She was already in her 60s when I met her. My first impression was how
> alive she was. Full of energy and extremely intelligent. Also one heck
> of a nice person. She was more proud of her navy career than of her
> computer accomplishments. IIRC, her father was also in the Navy.
>
> The Google animation ends with a moth flying out of the computer. Grace
> has the honor of discovering the very first computer "bug", a moth that
> created a short. The fried carcass was taped into the log book for the
> day :-).
>
> I met her at computer society meetings and various conventions. Often I
> was the only other person around that had worked on Univac (software, not
> hardware) so it was easy to get a conversation going - when she wasn't
> surrounded by younger admirers.
>
> The article mentions her famous "nanoseconds" - I've still got one of
> those somewhere. It didn't mention that she also hauled around a
> microsecond - about 1000 feet of wire. She joked that the phone company
> wouldn't give her enough wire for a millisecond.
>
> When she finally retired for good, they held the ceremony on "Old
> Ironsides".
>
> I could probably keep this up for another page or two, but suffice it to
> say I can't remember anyone who impressed me as much as Grace Hopper.
> She was the epitome of "one of a kind".
>

LB

Larry Blanchard

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

10/12/2013 5:52 PM

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 10:20:15 -0600, Swingman wrote:

> I'll never forget the sense of excitement of those times, having been a
> miniscule part of it as an early embracer of computer technology ...

A favorite story:

I was working at Hughes Aircraft in 1965-66 when they got their new GE635
running Multics (the anti-inspiration for Unix). The multi-tasking was a
little flaky. If you submitted a job the source listing came out on one
printer, the link map on another, and the results on a third. Completely
random. The operators hated rooting through stacks of paper to
reassemble each and every job :-).

I've got a lot of stories of early computing. One of these days I'll
have to write them down.

--
This message was for rec.woodworking - if it appears in homeownershub
they ripped it off.

MM

"Mike Marlow"

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

10/12/2013 1:36 PM

Swingman wrote:

>
> My very favorite book on computers and the early culture was Tracy
> Kidder's "Soul of A New Machine". Far from being on the bleeding edge
> now, I'll never forget the sense of excitement of those times, having
> been a miniscule part of it as an early embracer of computer
> technology ... including FidoNet, modem to modem application
> development, and early corporate Ethernet LAN's.

I was with Data General when that book came out, and it documented the
design and development of the Data General MV-8000. I installed the first
MV-8000 in our region (and one of the first few in the nation), at Syracuse
University. That computer marked an evolutionary milestone in the progress
of the mini/supermini world of computing. A true microcode driven machine,
utilized the very latest in very large scale integrated circuits, and
although I now forget the MIPS & MFLP ratings - it achieved what had been
held to be impossible levels of compute performance - at least in the
sub-mainframe class of compute engines. The culture within that design team
was something that was set apart from the rest of the DG culture in terms of
pushing limits beyond reasonable design expectations. DG was a company of
cowboys and renegades at that time, but the teams that produced the MV-8000
elevated that to new levels.


--

-Mike-
[email protected]

MM

"Mike Marlow"

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

10/12/2013 1:42 PM

Mike Marlow wrote:
> Swingman wrote:
>
>>
>> My very favorite book on computers and the early culture was Tracy
>> Kidder's "Soul of A New Machine". Far from being on the bleeding edge
>> now, I'll never forget the sense of excitement of those times, having
>> been a miniscule part of it as an early embracer of computer
>> technology ... including FidoNet, modem to modem application
>> development, and early corporate Ethernet LAN's.
>
> I was with Data General when that book came out, and it documented the
> design and development of the Data General MV-8000. I installed the
> first MV-8000 in our region (and one of the first few in the nation),
> at Syracuse University. That computer marked an evolutionary
> milestone in the progress of the mini/supermini world of computing. A true
> microcode driven machine, utilized the very latest in very
> large scale integrated circuits, and although I now forget the MIPS &
> MFLP ratings - it achieved what had been held to be impossible levels
> of compute performance - at least in the sub-mainframe class of
> compute engines. The culture within that design team was something
> that was set apart from the rest of the DG culture in terms of
> pushing limits beyond reasonable design expectations. DG was a
> company of cowboys and renegades at that time, but the teams that
> produced the MV-8000 elevated that to new levels.

I was just reminded of a poster we had at DG. This poster pre-dated the MV
series of machines, but still ranks as one of the coolest I've ever seen.
It stated... "We are the bastards of the industry - And proud of it!"

--

-Mike-
[email protected]

PB

Pat Barber

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

10/12/2013 2:25 PM

On 12/9/2013 9:40 AM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
> Those of you not involved with computers will wonder what made Admiral
> Hopper worthy of a Google day. I had the very great privilege of meeting
> and talking to her several times. She's worth a Google month at least.

Yes Sir....a first class act. I got to see her speak in Atlanta about
200 years ago. I remember being amazed that a woman had done some damn
much with very little recognition.

You didn't mention the word I sort of expected....COBOL


MM

"Mike Marlow"

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

10/12/2013 5:54 PM

Pat Barber wrote:
> On 12/9/2013 9:40 AM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
>> Those of you not involved with computers will wonder what made
>> Admiral Hopper worthy of a Google day. I had the very great
>> privilege of meeting and talking to her several times. She's worth
>> a Google month at least.
>
> Yes Sir....a first class act. I got to see her speak in Atlanta about
> 200 years ago. I remember being amazed that a woman had done some damn
> much with very little recognition.
>
> You didn't mention the word I sort of expected....COBOL

Genuflect when you say that word!

--

-Mike-
[email protected]

MM

"Mike Marlow"

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

10/12/2013 6:47 PM

woodchucker wrote:
> On 12/10/2013 1:36 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
>> Swingman wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> My very favorite book on computers and the early culture was Tracy
>>> Kidder's "Soul of A New Machine". Far from being on the bleeding
>>> edge now, I'll never forget the sense of excitement of those times,
>>> having been a miniscule part of it as an early embracer of computer
>>> technology ... including FidoNet, modem to modem application
>>> development, and early corporate Ethernet LAN's.
>>
>> I was with Data General when that book came out, and it documented
>> the design and development of the Data General MV-8000. I installed
>> the first MV-8000 in our region (and one of the first few in the
>> nation), at Syracuse University. That computer marked an
>> evolutionary milestone in the progress of the mini/supermini world
>> of computing. A true microcode driven machine, utilized the very
>> latest in very large scale integrated circuits, and although I now
>> forget the MIPS & MFLP ratings - it achieved what had been held to
>> be impossible levels of compute performance - at least in the
>> sub-mainframe class of compute engines. The culture within that
>> design team was something that was set apart from the rest of the DG
>> culture in terms of pushing limits beyond reasonable design
>> expectations. DG was a company of cowboys and renegades at that
>> time, but the teams that produced the MV-8000 elevated that to new
>> levels.
> I remember that machine, I had nova's and then a few mv8000's
>
> I can't believe I remembered the Nova's name...

Ahhh - the Nova... both the 3 and the 4. There really were not that many
Nova's and Nova 2' but the 3's and 4's were all over the place. Good little
machines that gave the PDP's a run for their money. Better equiped for
business processing than the PDP, but not quite as strong for scientific
processing. Then came the Eclipse which would out run any PDP - but it was
a day late and maybe even two days late.

>
> You are bringing back memories.

I know - as I was typing this stuff I realized exactly the same thing. That
was way back in my career when I was a tech, and when I actually knew
something. I remember really hating the big board technology, having come
from Honeywell where we fixed Xerox, GE and Honeywell computers to the
component level. When I got to DG it was all about swapping out a 15"
board. Any idiot could do that. Used to piss me off when the techs of that
time thought they were so hot because they could troubleshoot a problem to a
board within 2 hours. Shit - I used to do that to a transistor on a
mainframe. These guys carried Tektronix 465's in their cars for ballast in
the winter time and couldn't hook one up if free sex was on the other end of
the line. But - I digress. That's when I made my move to Systems
Engineering then eventually to Sales, and then eventually to Senior
Management. But those memories...

--

-Mike-
[email protected]

LB

Larry Blanchard

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 1:00 AM

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 18:47:44 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:

> Ahhh - the Nova... both the 3 and the 4. There really were not that
> many Nova's and Nova 2' but the 3's and 4's were all over the place.

Anyone remember the Interdata minis? They had a dial on the panel that
slowed the clock. You could get it down to where you could just read
each instruction as it executed. Sure made debugging simpler.

--
This message was for rec.woodworking - if it appears in homeownershub
they ripped it off.

LB

Larry Blanchard

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 1:13 AM

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 14:25:13 -0800, Pat Barber wrote:

> You didn't mention the word I sort of expected....COBOL

Actually, I would have mentioned CODASYL first, since I've always been
fascinated by DBMS's. Even wrote one in Fortran using B+ trees. The
CODASYL network model still makes a lot of sense, and Grace was on that
committee.

BTW, I got to talking to either Date or Codd (memory is the 2nd thing to
go) at the NCC where they introduced their relational model and they
pointed out that it was just the user interface. They were still
planning on using the network model underneath.

--
This message was for rec.woodworking - if it appears in homeownershub
they ripped it off.

MM

"Mike Marlow"

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

10/12/2013 9:23 PM

Larry Blanchard wrote:
> On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 18:47:44 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:
>
>> Ahhh - the Nova... both the 3 and the 4. There really were not that
>> many Nova's and Nova 2' but the 3's and 4's were all over the place.
>
> Anyone remember the Interdata minis? They had a dial on the panel
> that slowed the clock. You could get it down to where you could just
> read each instruction as it executed. Sure made debugging simpler.

Nope - don't remember that one, though the Xerox (originally Scientific Data
Systems) Sigma series had a single clock toggle. You could single step the
clock by taking it out of run mode. This wasn't a single instruction step -
you could do that from the Run switch - this was a true single clock switch.
You're right - an essential troubleshooting tool back in the day. The Sigma
wasn't a mini - it was a full 32 bit machine from the early 70's.

--

-Mike-
[email protected]

LB

Larry Blanchard

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 4:20 AM

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 14:25:13 -0800, Pat Barber wrote:

In looking around for CODASYL data, I found there's a book on Grace:

Grace Hopper: Admiral of the Cyber Sea

I'll have to get that one - anybody read it?

--
This message was for rec.woodworking - if it appears in homeownershub
they ripped it off.

Nw

Noons

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 8:26 PM

On 10/12/2013 1:43 PM, j wrote:

>> Those of you not involved with computers will wonder what made Admiral
>> Hopper worthy of a Google day. I had the very great privilege of meeting
>> and talking to her several times. She's worth a Google month at least.

Aye, indeed!

dn

dpb

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 9:40 AM

On 12/9/2013 11:40 AM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
> Those of you not involved with computers will wonder what made Admiral
> Hopper worthy of a Google day. I had the very great privilege of meeting
> and talking to her several times. She's worth a Google month at least.
...

> I could probably keep this up for another page or two, but suffice it to
> say I can't remember anyone who impressed me as much as Grace Hopper.
> She was the epitome of "one of a kind".

While taking nothing away from Admiral Hopper, being on the
scientific/engineering computing side rather than business, John Backus
and FORTRAN was far more influential in the arena of my experience
followed probably most closely by Seymour Cray ( and the CDC-6600).

I never had an opportunity to see any DG machines except from afar...by
the time left the mainframe organizations, the VAX/VMS was nearly
ubiquitous and then my career path went the other extreme of embedded
micros for quite a long period before the PC then became powerful-enough
to be of real use for anything beyond word processing w/ the AT-class...

--


MM

"Mike Marlow"

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 11:03 AM

dpb wrote:

>
> While taking nothing away from Admiral Hopper, being on the
> scientific/engineering computing side rather than business, John
> Backus and FORTRAN was far more influential in the arena of my
> experience followed probably most closely by Seymour Cray ( and the
> CDC-6600).

Well - that's only because you were living in the isolated world of
scientific computing, which we all knew was just an "interesting"
diversion...

> I never had an opportunity to see any DG machines except from
> afar...by the time left the mainframe organizations, the VAX/VMS was
> nearly ubiquitous and then my career path went the other extreme of
> embedded micros for quite a long period before the PC then became
> powerful-enough to be of real use for anything beyond word processing
> w/ the AT-class...

I understand that. I saw - early on, the advatages of the small computer.
It did not matter to me if it was the PC or the Sun model of the
client/server infrastructure - it all came down to the same thing. Having
come from the mainframe world, and even then with a continued appreciation
for where the mainframe would fit in, that the small footprint compute
device with some level of local compute capability as opposed to a simple
dumb screeen - was the wave of the future. Ahhhhl.... the good old days.


--

-Mike-
[email protected]

BH

Brian Hoyt

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 12:48 PM

On 10/12/2013 10:23 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
> Larry Blanchard wrote:
>> On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 18:47:44 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:
>>
>>> Ahhh - the Nova... both the 3 and the 4. There really were not that
>>> many Nova's and Nova 2' but the 3's and 4's were all over the place.
>>
>> Anyone remember the Interdata minis? They had a dial on the panel
>> that slowed the clock. You could get it down to where you could just
>> read each instruction as it executed. Sure made debugging simpler.
>
> Nope - don't remember that one, though the Xerox (originally Scientific Data
> Systems) Sigma series had a single clock toggle. You could single step the
> clock by taking it out of run mode. This wasn't a single instruction step -
> you could do that from the Run switch - this was a true single clock switch.
> You're right - an essential troubleshooting tool back in the day. The Sigma
> wasn't a mini - it was a full 32 bit machine from the early 70's.
>

We had a Sigma 5 which I maintained after the Honeywell Service contract
got too expensive. A wonderful machine built by the true cowboys in
Austin, TX. When it came down for maintenance, the last thing it did
was play the Star Spangled Banner. I listened to it every Sunday morning
at about 9:00 AM.

brian

--
Brian Hoyt
Stillwater Lake, NS
Canada

dn

dpb

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 12:15 PM

On 12/11/2013 10:03 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
> dpb wrote:
>
>>
>> While taking nothing away from Admiral Hopper, being on the
>> scientific/engineering computing side rather than business, John
>> Backus and FORTRAN was far more influential in the arena of my
>> experience followed probably most closely by Seymour Cray ( and the
>> CDC-6600).
>
> Well - that's only because you were living in the isolated world of
> scientific computing, which we all knew was just an "interesting"
> diversion...
>
>> I never had an opportunity to see any DG machines except from
>> afar...by the time left the mainframe organizations, the VAX/VMS was
>> nearly ubiquitous and then my career path went the other extreme of
>> embedded micros for quite a long period before the PC then became
>> powerful-enough to be of real use for anything beyond word processing
>> w/ the AT-class...
>
> I understand that. I saw - early on, the advatages of the small computer.
> It did not matter to me if it was the PC or the Sun model of the
> client/server infrastructure - it all came down to the same thing. Having
> come from the mainframe world, and even then with a continued appreciation
> for where the mainframe would fit in, that the small footprint compute
> device with some level of local compute capability as opposed to a simple
> dumb screeen - was the wave of the future. Ahhhhl.... the good old days.

And even before the CDC, there was the Philco 2000 (that had direct
experience on, that is). All the Bettis Lab nuclear design codes
written for the Navy were originally only available for the Philco.
These codes were the basis for the commercial reactor vendors' (B&W, W,
CE, GE) light-water design tools modified to fit particular designs. My
first job out out of uni was to first learn to run these codes with
facility and then begin upgrading and extending them for specific
features and additional computations not in the originals.

When Philco didn't have the resources to keep up in the
high-performance-computing arena, Bettis went to CDC and all the vendors
subsequently followed as there were no alternatives other than a
complete independent rewrite/port to some other machine which just
wasn't feasible option.

<http://archive.computerhistory.org/resources/access/text/2010/09/102646276-05-01-acc.pdf>

The B&W installation included 27(! count'em :) ) 7-track tape
drives--great fun for the operators to keep up with, and only slightly
less for writing code to keep track of which cross-section set was where
during the multi-group to few-group reduction...

--

TD

"Tom Dacon"

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 10:29 AM

"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message news:[email protected]...

On Tue, 10 Dec 2013 18:47:44 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:

>>Ahhh - the Nova... both the 3 and the 4. There really were not that
>> many Nova's and Nova 2' but the 3's and 4's were all over the place.

>Anyone remember the Interdata minis?

Ah, the Interdata minis...an instruction set that was based on the IBM 360
set, with some useful improvements (stack handling, anyone?). The 8/32, at
least, and perhaps other models, had a machine instruction that switched the
machine into the straight IBM 360 instruction set. My team created a mini-OS
360 operating system for it, mixed with some CMS aspects, to run a large
mainframe CAD system on an 8/32 as a single-user workstation. A fun little
machine. I also programmed the Novas.

Tom

BB

Bill

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 2:49 PM

Markem wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 11:03:44 -0500, "Mike Marlow"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> dpb wrote:
>>
>>> While taking nothing away from Admiral Hopper, being on the
>>> scientific/engineering computing side rather than business, John
>>> Backus and FORTRAN was far more influential in the arena of my
>>> experience followed probably most closely by Seymour Cray ( and the
>>> CDC-6600).
>> Well - that's only because you were living in the isolated world of
>> scientific computing, which we all knew was just an "interesting"
>> diversion...
>>
>>> I never had an opportunity to see any DG machines except from
>>> afar...by the time left the mainframe organizations, the VAX/VMS was
>>> nearly ubiquitous and then my career path went the other extreme of
>>> embedded micros for quite a long period before the PC then became
>>> powerful-enough to be of real use for anything beyond word processing
>>> w/ the AT-class...
>> I understand that. I saw - early on, the advatages of the small computer.
>> It did not matter to me if it was the PC or the Sun model of the
>> client/server infrastructure - it all came down to the same thing. Having
>> come from the mainframe world, and even then with a continued appreciation
>> for where the mainframe would fit in, that the small footprint compute
>> device with some level of local compute capability as opposed to a simple
>> dumb screeen - was the wave of the future. Ahhhhl.... the good old days.
> So any of you folks remember Gandalf Data?
I remember someone in education referring to that thing (modem) sitting
next to the keyboard and monitors (no, not a PC) as a "gandalf"!
After all, that's how it was labeled! : )


> Was working there on data
> sets, Pacx and so on. Then along came the PC and the whole backbone of
> Gandalfs busines model went KABOOM!
>
> But I did learn how to be an electronic tech, and discovered an inate
> ability to troubleshoot. It is nice when people pay you to play.
>
> Mark

BB

Bill

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 2:55 PM

Bill wrote:
> Markem wrote:
>> On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 11:03:44 -0500, "Mike Marlow"
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> dpb wrote:
>>>
>>>> While taking nothing away from Admiral Hopper, being on the
>>>> scientific/engineering computing side rather than business, John
>>>> Backus and FORTRAN was far more influential in the arena of my
>>>> experience followed probably most closely by Seymour Cray ( and the
>>>> CDC-6600).
>>> Well - that's only because you were living in the isolated world of
>>> scientific computing, which we all knew was just an "interesting"
>>> diversion...
>>>
>>>> I never had an opportunity to see any DG machines except from
>>>> afar...by the time left the mainframe organizations, the VAX/VMS was
>>>> nearly ubiquitous and then my career path went the other extreme of
>>>> embedded micros for quite a long period before the PC then became
>>>> powerful-enough to be of real use for anything beyond word processing
>>>> w/ the AT-class...
>>> I understand that. I saw - early on, the advatages of the small
>>> computer.
>>> It did not matter to me if it was the PC or the Sun model of the
>>> client/server infrastructure - it all came down to the same thing.
>>> Having
>>> come from the mainframe world, and even then with a continued
>>> appreciation
>>> for where the mainframe would fit in, that the small footprint compute
>>> device with some level of local compute capability as opposed to a
>>> simple
>>> dumb screeen - was the wave of the future. Ahhhhl.... the good old
>>> days.
>> So any of you folks remember Gandalf Data?
> I remember someone in education referring to that thing (modem)
> sitting next to the keyboard and monitors (no, not a PC) as a "gandalf"!
> After all, that's how it was labeled! : )
>
>
She said, "There should be a red or green light flashing on The Gandalf"!


>> Was working there on data
>> sets, Pacx and so on. Then along came the PC and the whole backbone of
>> Gandalfs busines model went KABOOM!
>>
>> But I did learn how to be an electronic tech, and discovered an inate
>> ability to troubleshoot. It is nice when people pay you to play.
>>
>> Mark
>

dn

dpb

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 3:12 PM

On 12/11/2013 1:49 PM, Markem wrote:
...

> So any of you folks remember Gandalf Data? Was working there on data
> sets, Pacx and so on. Then along came the PC and the whole backbone of
> Gandalfs busines model went KABOOM!
>
...

No, can't say as had ever even heard of it 'til now. That would have
been my period into embedded or standalone micros mostly it appears when
rarely ever saw anything bigger than a 6809 or just maybe for really,
really big stuff a 68000. The "monster" was a VME-bus 3-processor 68k
system--two on the remote vehicle and another for the operator command
station for a man-replacement mobile robotic handler system for
commercial nuclear plant applications for Remotec.

On a similar communications path to near obsolescence at a later time,
my son went to work as sales engineer for Hummingbird in boom times for
the Exceed connectivity package when he finished uni. Went great guns
for a few years...

--

LB

Larry Blanchard

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 10:09 PM

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 11:03:44 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:

> Well - that's only because you were living in the isolated world of
> scientific computing, which we all knew was just an "interesting"
> diversion...

And then there was SCADA - supervisory control and data acquisition.
Often just called process control. I got into that by accident and got
involved in all sorts of strange but interesting projects.

--
This message was for rec.woodworking - if it appears in homeownershub
they ripped it off.

MM

"Mike Marlow"

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

12/12/2013 1:04 AM

Brian Hoyt wrote:

>
> We had a Sigma 5 which I maintained after the Honeywell Service
> contract got too expensive. A wonderful machine built by the true
> cowboys in Austin, TX. When it came down for maintenance, the last
> thing it did was play the Star Spangled Banner. I listened to it
> every Sunday morning at about 9:00 AM.
>

Sigma 5 was the first of the XDS machines I worked on. Back then we did not
have load and go diagnostics so to troubleshoot you had to know how the
machine worked, and you kept the Programmer's Reference Card in your pocket
so you could fat finger in an instruction loop of your own making, at the
front panel. A real man's computer! I installed one the first maps in a
Sigma 5 that took addressable memory up to... wait - you're not going to
believe this... 128K! And that was manly memory too - real core memory!

--

-Mike-
[email protected]

MM

"Mike Marlow"

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

12/12/2013 1:05 AM

Brian Hoyt wrote:

>
> We had a Sigma 5 which I maintained after the Honeywell Service
> contract got too expensive. A wonderful machine built by the true
> cowboys in Austin, TX. When it came down for maintenance, the last
> thing it did was play the Star Spangled Banner. I listened to it
> every Sunday morning at about 9:00 AM.
>

BTW - ZAP!

--

-Mike-
[email protected]

MM

"Mike Marlow"

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

12/12/2013 1:13 AM

Larry Blanchard wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 11:03:44 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:
>
>> Well - that's only because you were living in the isolated world of
>> scientific computing, which we all knew was just an "interesting"
>> diversion...
>
> And then there was SCADA - supervisory control and data acquisition.
> Often just called process control. I got into that by accident and
> got involved in all sorts of strange but interesting projects.

I spent a short time in that space myself. I worked for a company called
Masscomp that built a machine with a VME buss front end for data aq. I got
to visit some really cool places - an animal surgury facility where a dog
was hooked up to all kinds of electrodes going into the front of my
machine - and I had to fix the machine... To Marshall Space Flight Center
where I passed code and instructions through a secure phone from an outer
lobby type area, to controllers inside, who passed them up to the astronauts
orbiting the earth with our computer on board - doing who knows what. Got a
tour of some really cool stuff afterwards, including the wind tunnel where
they really did launch chickens at airplane canopies.

Man these memories just keep happening. You guys gotta quit bringing all
this stuff up.

--

-Mike-
[email protected]

LB

Larry Blanchard

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

12/12/2013 6:30 PM

On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 01:13:17 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:

> To Marshall Space Flight Center
> where I passed code and instructions through a secure phone from an
> outer lobby type area, to controllers inside, who passed them up to the
> astronauts orbiting the earth with our computer on board

Never got to Marshall, but did some work with Modcomp computers at NASA
Edwards. Got a real kick out of sitting in a shuttle cockpit mockup and
playing with the controls to check my software.

Weirdest job was instrumenting squid nerve cells to test the effect of
various drugs on nerve function. Squid nerve cells are huge, relatively
speaking.

And I never finished high school!

--
This message was for rec.woodworking - if it appears in homeownershub
they ripped it off.

Mm

Markem

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

11/12/2013 1:49 PM

On Wed, 11 Dec 2013 11:03:44 -0500, "Mike Marlow"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>dpb wrote:
>
>>
>> While taking nothing away from Admiral Hopper, being on the
>> scientific/engineering computing side rather than business, John
>> Backus and FORTRAN was far more influential in the arena of my
>> experience followed probably most closely by Seymour Cray ( and the
>> CDC-6600).
>
>Well - that's only because you were living in the isolated world of
>scientific computing, which we all knew was just an "interesting"
>diversion...
>
>> I never had an opportunity to see any DG machines except from
>> afar...by the time left the mainframe organizations, the VAX/VMS was
>> nearly ubiquitous and then my career path went the other extreme of
>> embedded micros for quite a long period before the PC then became
>> powerful-enough to be of real use for anything beyond word processing
>> w/ the AT-class...
>
>I understand that. I saw - early on, the advatages of the small computer.
>It did not matter to me if it was the PC or the Sun model of the
>client/server infrastructure - it all came down to the same thing. Having
>come from the mainframe world, and even then with a continued appreciation
>for where the mainframe would fit in, that the small footprint compute
>device with some level of local compute capability as opposed to a simple
>dumb screeen - was the wave of the future. Ahhhhl.... the good old days.

So any of you folks remember Gandalf Data? Was working there on data
sets, Pacx and so on. Then along came the PC and the whole backbone of
Gandalfs busines model went KABOOM!

But I did learn how to be an electronic tech, and discovered an inate
ability to troubleshoot. It is nice when people pay you to play.

Mark

wn

woodchucker

in reply to Larry Blanchard on 09/12/2013 5:40 PM

10/12/2013 6:14 PM

On 12/10/2013 1:36 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
> Swingman wrote:
>
>>
>> My very favorite book on computers and the early culture was Tracy
>> Kidder's "Soul of A New Machine". Far from being on the bleeding edge
>> now, I'll never forget the sense of excitement of those times, having
>> been a miniscule part of it as an early embracer of computer
>> technology ... including FidoNet, modem to modem application
>> development, and early corporate Ethernet LAN's.
>
> I was with Data General when that book came out, and it documented the
> design and development of the Data General MV-8000. I installed the first
> MV-8000 in our region (and one of the first few in the nation), at Syracuse
> University. That computer marked an evolutionary milestone in the progress
> of the mini/supermini world of computing. A true microcode driven machine,
> utilized the very latest in very large scale integrated circuits, and
> although I now forget the MIPS & MFLP ratings - it achieved what had been
> held to be impossible levels of compute performance - at least in the
> sub-mainframe class of compute engines. The culture within that design team
> was something that was set apart from the rest of the DG culture in terms of
> pushing limits beyond reasonable design expectations. DG was a company of
> cowboys and renegades at that time, but the teams that produced the MV-8000
> elevated that to new levels.
>
>
I remember that machine, I had nova's and then a few mv8000's

I can't believe I remembered the Nova's name...

You are bringing back memories.

--
Jeff


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